Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
Mock-up
Ok, so I had 20 minutes to kill this afternoon while the wife was out and I couldn't resist having a muck about with the LEDs.
See the pics below for the results and a couple in my gallery.
My initial reaction is that they are too close together and look a bit pants like that, but I don't know. What do you guys think? By the way, they are blimmin bright!
How/why did I do it? I was looking at the front of the car and noticed that the slits in the plastic cover are remarkably similar in size to the LEDs. I gave it a go and they fit perfectly height-wise. I remembered I had a 'spare' cover that I'd left off my lease LR3 on an off-road trip and forgot to put back on when I returned it...
There are some vertical moulded struts in the way, so...hacksaw, meet mr plastic cover...voila...
Obviously this is not as per the position instructions in the LED manual (which refers to the EC directives)...BUT WAIT...I don't live in Europe any more, I'm in cowboy country where everyone seems to do whatever they like, especially with their cars. I did a bit of quick googling and couldn't find anything specific to positioning of daytime running lights in the relevant federal regulations (Sec. 571.108 Standard No. 108; Lamps, reflective devices, and associated equipment.)
Sod it, I thought, and did the mock-up and wired them up temporarily with gaffer tape.
They are off again now but I might have the bumper off tomorrow when I have more time. I had a peep behind the plastic from underneath and the steel bumper is too low to hang the lights from, as they'd end up in the curved bit of the plastic and probably look a bit weird either hanging out too far or being recessed too much depending on how you fit them.
Oh, and I have some Xenons arriving on Tuesday to fit too 8)'08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
14th Feb 2009 11:51 pm
Nico G4-2
Member Since: 11 Nov 2008
Location: Pretoria
Posts: 128
Please post Xenon detail when it happens
Not to fond of the LED driving lights - we have sun here in Africa - but Xenon's now that I will need...
Tx
NicoNico
'91 BYB - Big Yellow Bus: Ex-CT Tdi Disco
'05 BOV - Big Orange Van: TDV6 D3 G4 - Hit a COW the animal kind
'11 BBB - Big Black Bus: D4 HSE 5.0 V8 - busy with MODS
'16 KIA SEDONA - 11 SEATS
SWAMBO ... Small black number - RCZ
15th Feb 2009 7:53 pm
BrewMonkey
Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
I showed the photos of the mock-up to my wife. She called me a chav and started taking the mick "are you going to put some blue neons underneath?"...blah blah..."fast and the furious"..."essex boy racer"...blah... It wouldn't be so bad, but this was during the interval after she dragged me to see Riverdance today as well!!! Cheek of it. Some pretty hot chicks in it though, I must admit.
Might have to rethink this... '08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
15th Feb 2009 11:15 pm
caverD3
Member Since: 03 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
Not a fan either. Folk will start to look for lights rather than vehicles. For motorbike riders who now stand out will now disapear from motorists perception. “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
15th Feb 2009 11:31 pm
BrewMonkey
Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
CaverD3, good to see someone thinking bike first. I've been a biker all my life and spent a period of a couple of years without a car (riding a Thunderace then a Fireblade as daily transport). I am all for anything that helps biker safety, having been involved in a 'sorry I didn't see you' accident that cost a fractured vertebra.
With respect, I can't really agree with the claims of DRLs adversely affecting bikers in this way. There are plenty of reports and results of studies that both support and refute the case for DRLs adversely affecting perceived biker visibility. I haven't read one yet that is convincing enough in either direction. Given this, my own opinion is that I don't think bikers will be less visible due to more cars having DRLs. There are good drivers and bad ones - more bad than good. I gave up hope years ago that the tide would shift and any biker wanting to survive needs to assume that anyone at a junction hasn't seen them and ride accordingly. Having driven in Michigan for the last two years, I am even more disheartened - the observation skills and ability to think ahead are alarmingly absent (Michigan is bad though).
[EDIT] I should add though that if there is some very convincing evidence supporting the theory of DRLs adversely affecting the safety of bikers, I won't hesitate to eat my words, reverse my position and cut the wires. '08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
16th Feb 2009 12:18 am
caverD3
Member Since: 03 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
Just common sense really.
Scenario one:
No driving lights on. Only one light which is a bike.
Scenario two:
Driving lights on all. All are equally visible. Which is the single bike light and how far away is it? ........ I see two points of light umm... vehicle is close.............I see one point of light must be a car along way away. I can pull out..........ooops O sh#t its a bike! (dead)
Not much in it but could be enough to make the difference.
I always rode assuming the idiot at the stop sign had not seen me with my light on, refective jacket and reflective stipes on my fairing. “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
16th Feb 2009 4:23 am
BrewMonkey
Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
caverD3 wrote:
Just common sense really.
No, not really, although I have had a few Boddingtons.
Scenario 2 I'm not sure I agree with. What sort of distances do car lights blend into one during the day? How far away does a bike have to be to look like a car and if it does, how fast is he going to make it dangerous if a car pulls out (stopping distances etc.). I haven't seen any results of tests with distances etc. If you have any links to research I'd like to see them. I do agree with your philosophy that any marginal difference in legislation is worthwhile if it might save but one life.
Is Scenario 1 really intended to imply that any point of light on the road visible to a driver is a bike? Ok, in an ideal world, all drivers who see a light should think bike and triple check. Fair point and something that I wish would happen, but stopping mobile phone usage in cars and educating bikers on more defensive riding would be would be more effective than this.
'Sorry I didn't see you' is way, way more often down to the useless in the car doing something other than looking rather than not physically being able to see the bike they pulled out on. Greater visibility would obviously help, but I've looked in people's eyes and had them pull out on me (in the D3 as well as on a bike). Barring full beam flashing and a lighthouse strobe on my helmet, these idiots still wouldn't notice.'08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
16th Feb 2009 5:57 am
BrewMonkey
Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
Ok, I concede (didn't take long, did it - told you I admit if I'm wrong!). Woke up this morning (sans Boddingtons) not convinced by my own arguments. CaverD3 said "Not much in it but could be enough to make the difference", and that's enough to make me hold my horses and at least look into and understand the research and practical aspects more. At the very least, the pictures with the lights close together do highlight the issue them looking like a single point of light sooner than ones spaced wider. The EC regulations do stipulate a minimum distance after all. There was some interesting reading here: http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/vehicles/v...inalreport
Anyhow, don't drink and type kids .'08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
16th Feb 2009 2:12 pm
Ian62
Member Since: 17 Mar 2007
Location: Cyprus
Posts: 238
Neil, when I first got my lights I wanted to put them in about the same spot you had yours but after reading the regulations I figured there had to be a reason why they have to be a min. distance apart.
Come on mate don't be shy, go for it cut that bumper.....
Stadt Panzer Power
16th Feb 2009 6:48 pm
BrewMonkey
Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
I have to admit that I am properly papping myself at the thought of cutting the bumper now it's real... '08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
16th Feb 2009 8:06 pm
caverD3
Member Since: 03 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
Must have been the Boddingtons working overnight, BrewMonkey. “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
16th Feb 2009 10:31 pm
BrewMonkey
Member Since: 25 Apr 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 70
It worked in many ways...at least that's what I found out sat on the loo this morning. Haven't had that much ale in a while and forgot the morning after side effects... '08 LR3 V8 SE in Stornoway Gray, Alpaca interior. Xenons, Cold Weather Pack, Bluetooth & Sirius. General Grabber AT2s. EBC Sport Rotors & Green Stuff Pads, Traxide SC80 kit half fitted...
'11 Mini Cooper S Countryman, True Blue.
16th Feb 2009 11:08 pm
foofighter
Member Since: 11 Mar 2006
Location: The OC
Posts: 100
CY wrote:
Tim in Scotland devised a very smart LED set up for his TDV8. Worked in to the original headlamp cluster.
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It wouldn't be so bad, but this was during the interval after she dragged me to see Riverdance today as well!!! Cheek of it. 
Some pretty hot chicks in it though, I must admit.
(dead)
in the car doing something other than looking rather than not physically being able to see the bike they pulled out on. Greater visibility would obviously help, but I've looked in people's eyes and had them pull out on me (in the D3 as well as on a bike). Barring full beam flashing and a lighthouse strobe on my helmet, these idiots still wouldn't notice.
.
I figured there had to be a reason why they have to be a min. distance apart. 
