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Red Merle
 


Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 4930

United Kingdom 

Laughing Laughing
 Three very nice FL2’s and two superb Disco 4’s to date.
With them both sadly out of production and a new Disco needed at short notice, I managed to get LR’s nearest new equivalent - a FFRR 😗 
 
Post #19129269th Feb 2018 10:32 pm
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fat bloke
 


Member Since: 07 Aug 2006
Location: OXFORD
Posts: 1136

United Kingdom 2015 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 SE Auto Santorini BlackDiscovery 4

It's also a shame LandRovers engines are not on par with BMW or Audi with the wide scale of small to large engines and refined ?
  
Post #191328710th Feb 2018 9:51 pm
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DG
Site Moderator 


Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 45094

United Kingdom 

Terrible shame Rolling Eyes ...but the JLR have only been producing their own engines since 2012 ...I guess the Germans have a bit of a head start. Laughing
  
Post #191328910th Feb 2018 10:01 pm
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Red Merle
 


Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 4930

United Kingdom 

That and the fact that Audi are owned by the biggest motor manufacturer in the world and are able to buy in from that wide range of engines.

On the plus side, JLR haven’t needed to resort to deception to get emissions approval Thumbs Up
 Three very nice FL2’s and two superb Disco 4’s to date.
With them both sadly out of production and a new Disco needed at short notice, I managed to get LR’s nearest new equivalent - a FFRR 😗 
 
Post #191329210th Feb 2018 10:08 pm
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J77
 


Member Since: 03 Mar 2008
Location: Fife
Posts: 4193

Scotland 

Must admit I’m pleasantly surprised with the SD4 240. A bit rough when cold, slight hesitation when pulling away but that’s been present on most auto LRs regardless of engine manufacture. It’s smooth and quiet once warmed up and quite perky. Pretty pleased so far.

Fuel economy, according to the car, 44mpg.
 18MY Velar R-Dynamic SE D240, Fuji White  
Post #191329310th Feb 2018 10:11 pm
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jimbg
 


Member Since: 19 Apr 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 408

United Kingdom 

fat bloke wrote:
It's also a shame LandRovers engines are not on par with BMW or Audi with the wide scale of small to large engines and refined ?


Apart from the law suits over all the failed BMW N47 engines! Thumbs Up

LR are not that bad, the odd crank failure aside... Shocked Shocked

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/cons...e-failures
  
Post #191330710th Feb 2018 11:08 pm
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DiscoStu
 


Member Since: 09 Apr 2006
Location: London
Posts: 11335

England 

But the crank failures are Ford engines - one of the reasons JLR wanted to build their own.
 Disco 5 HSE Lux
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peyiqaJrmMU 
 
Post #191334011th Feb 2018 8:23 am
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Red Merle
 


Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 4930

United Kingdom 

jimbg wrote:
fat bloke wrote:
It's also a shame LandRovers engines are not on par with BMW or Audi with the wide scale of small to large engines and refined ?


Apart from the law suits over all the failed BMW N47 engines! Thumbs Up

LR are not that bad, the odd crank failure aside... Shocked Shocked

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/cons...e-failures


A friend had one of these fail on his 4 year old 520d M Sport. It was his umpteenth BMW. BMW’s response was:

“Book it into your dealer and have them strip the engine, at your expense. If they say it’s a manufacturing defect, we’ll talk.”

ie if they say it isn’t a “manufacturing fault” then the cost of the strip down, reassembly and ultimately, the repair is down to the customer. Even if it turns out to be a manufacturing defect, they were still only offering “to talk”, no commitment to actually pay!

With between 80 and 90,000 miles on it, he sold it to a trader, a trader “specialising in problem cars” for just £4,000. When the trader collected it he said that he’d recently collected a BMW X3 direct from the dealer, having paid the owner nothing but simply having settled the dealers labour charges for dismantling the engine!!

He’s since bought a used Jaguar XF 2.2d and he’s well chuffed with it Thumbs Up

And I won’t even start on the camchain issues on BMW’s “Prince” engine in the R56 Cooper S...

So, let’s forget about the wonder of BMW engines, or the broad range of off the shelf VW engines fitted to Audi’s. JLR have done a good job building an engine range and factory from scratch and have stood by their Ford sourced engines far better than BMW would appear to have stood by their own N47 units.
 Three very nice FL2’s and two superb Disco 4’s to date.
With them both sadly out of production and a new Disco needed at short notice, I managed to get LR’s nearest new equivalent - a FFRR 😗 
 
Post #191334611th Feb 2018 8:51 am
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jimbg
 


Member Since: 19 Apr 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 408

United Kingdom 

Red Merle, exactly right.

There is a long thread on the RRS forum about the crank failures and to read it and some of the responses you would believe that your car was bound to fail imminently.

JLR are not as bad as they are painted sometimes. You can get tunnel vision when you spend a lot of time on a forum!! Thumbs Up
  
Post #191335911th Feb 2018 9:51 am
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Moo
D3 Decade 


Member Since: 13 Aug 2010
Location: Wiltshire
Posts: 6206

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 S Manual Zambezi SilverDiscovery 3

At 218,000 miles I’m happy with my old buses reliability. I’ve owned and run BMW and Audi’s alongside my Discovery. I’ve got shot of them all and kept my old bus which is coming up to her 13th birthday. She has been to most stupidly reliable car ever. Thumbs Up
 Original Owner
222,233 miles and counting
05 S manual owned from March 2005
D4 Face lifted
V8 Front brakes
BAS Remap, Allisport Intercooler and deCat
EGRs blanked
T-Max split charge
Hanibal Expeedition rack
Prospeed ladder
Duratrac tyres
IID BT
BAS FBH control 
 
Post #191337711th Feb 2018 11:03 am
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ratrunner
 


Member Since: 20 Nov 2015
Location: cotswolds
Posts: 114

United Kingdom 2015 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 SE Auto Santorini BlackDiscovery 4

lespes wrote:
Land Rover
Discovery European sales
2016 12.939
2015 12.317
2014 11.239
2013 10.325
2012 12.386
2011 12.120
2010 12.973
2009 10.018
2008 11.923
2007 17.816
2006 19.799
2005 23.125
2004 16.485
2003 16.864
2002 17.906
2001 19.776
2000 18.899
1999 22.548
1998 18.849
1997 27.487

Seems overall Disco sales have been in decline in Europe for sometime
So many people now see LR as unreliable,it just seems to have this reputation whether its justified or not.When I say to people I have a Land Rover D4 I am getting used to the comment has it broken down yet ?..well not yet but start stop does not work, never has.My first land Rover a D1 back in 19991 broke down eight miles after I collected it brand new from the dealer. After that I flirted with many marques and had three Nissan Teranos brilliant never broke down but the temptation was to much and I went back to a D 2 which was good,just that,good.  
Post #191876825th Feb 2018 4:00 pm
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kajtzu
 


Member Since: 11 Aug 2017
Location: Helsinki
Posts: 1919

Finland 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Cairns BlueDiscovery 3

The sales data doesn’t support causality with vehicles being unreliable. Other kinds of studies would be needed to determine what the reasons are, if any. For 2017, I pulled the figure from carsalessdatabase.com.

Sales for Discovery in Europe
Click image to enlarge


Granted, sales are significantly less than 20 years ago. They jumped in 2005 and 2010 when D3 and D4 were introduced. Looking at the data the sales are actually up in Europe for every year starting 2014 when the D4.5 facelift was introduced. Personally I liked pre-D4.5 look more but either I’m wrong or how it looks is less important than other factors.

My amateur guess (not a car industry analyst) on why sales are down from 20 years ago range from taxation, cost of fuel, more choice within the brand, more choice outside the brand, different sales segment focus (why we are bitching the D5 for...), consumers in Europe want to buy greener vehicles, macroeconomic reasons (recession starting 2008/2009), consumer confidence in the future, etc. in no particular order.

Edit: I was curious so I plotted the same for US sales. The housing and banking crisis shows very nicely up there. Must have truly sucked to be JLR USA or a dealer in 2008-2009.

Sales for Discovery in USA
Click image to enlarge


For 2017 the sales in the beginning of the year in were very low. I guess they were out of stock and didn’t want to/could not build more D4.5 models - I think last D4.5 rolled out October/November September 2016? So they had to be out of NAS vehicles except whatever they still had in play at distributor level depots or at dealers. The cool down in sales lasted until D5 introduction in June 2017. Sales after D5 intro have been back to normal levels.

Edit N: last month was 9/2016
 

Last edited by kajtzu on 25th Feb 2018 9:39 pm. Edited 1 time in total 
Post #191882525th Feb 2018 6:19 pm
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Red Merle
 


Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 4930

United Kingdom 

Unfortunately, D4 stopped in the September. I remember because I was trying (but failed!) to buy a new one at the time Big Cry
 Three very nice FL2’s and two superb Disco 4’s to date.
With them both sadly out of production and a new Disco needed at short notice, I managed to get LR’s nearest new equivalent - a FFRR 😗 
 
Post #191891025th Feb 2018 9:30 pm
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kajtzu
 


Member Since: 11 Aug 2017
Location: Helsinki
Posts: 1919

Finland 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Cairns BlueDiscovery 3

That’s fine, a month here or there doesn’t matter when we talk about ro-ro carriers and stockpiling stuff near the harbor. Wink due to costs involved I doubt they’d let them leave half empty either. The official figure for factory orders to USA is 3-4 months after all.
  
Post #191891625th Feb 2018 9:36 pm
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Canburne
 


Member Since: 15 Jan 2013
Location: Devon
Posts: 1479

United Kingdom 2016 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 Landmark LE Auto Waitomo GreyDiscovery 4

Certainly since 2005/6 there have been lots and lots of much cheaper soft SUV's available in Europe so it is not surprising JLR is losing out in sales
 "the inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings....the inherent vice of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries" Winston Churchill

2016 D4 Landmark Club Waitomo ...or is it Club Tempest????
2015 D4 HSE Aintree Green 
 
Post #191896825th Feb 2018 11:36 pm
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