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RR08
Member Since: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Somerset
Posts: 26
  
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What concerns me is if someone is injured or killed on one of these events as a result of poor management and a failure of the Duty of Care.
In North Wales rescues can be very difficult in winter months due to the weather and access to some sites, the Bala site cannot be easily accessed by Helicopter or Ambulance due to the Forest and Terrain and location.
The site is approximately 1500 ft above sea level and cannot be accessed by conventional rescue resources without considerable difficulty.
Also the weather on site can change very quickly and this is of considerable concern.
At the end of the day events like this should be run safely and be fun and should not result in LRE clients being left to pick up the bill's running in to the thousands. It is of considerable concern to me as to what happened on the 8th of February 2008.
At the moment the matter is being investigated by Landrover Head Office and LRE Malvern which is the corporate LRE.
Landrover Experience have a Duty of Care to all clients of LRE.
I would be interested to hear from anyone with bad experience of LRE Snowdonia or Cheshire who are the same organisation.
Regards
Terry
RR08
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 Sat Feb 28 2009 11:47pm |
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MacLeod 313
Member Since: 18 Apr 2008
Location: away
Posts: 10723
  
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 Having not been on these events YET  , I was always assured that PROPER D3 forum events are Non damaging and under proper instruction. Damage to vehicles or persons happens only when advice is not heeded.
So canny see that this is a forum event.
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| Sat Feb 28 2009 11:53pm |
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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 15752
 
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It important to point out that the event on the 8th of Feb 2009 was definitly NOT a DISCO3.CO.UK organised event.
Whilst I sympathise with your predicament, I think I speak for most on here, when I say that we value our good relationships with certain LRE centres, and other organations that provide us with off-road driving instruction and facilities, All previous events that have been promoted through this forum have passed off safely and with very few damaging incidents.
There is always a risk involved when driving off-road, nobody can guarantee a non damaging event. I personally make sure my insurance covers me as far a possible for off-road driving, although I have never tested it thankfully.
I agree that negligence is not acceptable, but why did nobody taking part discuss the risks before entering the site on the 8th Feb? Club 18 - 30 (I wish !!)
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 12:14am |
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Dom Harvey
Lord of the Four Fingers
Member Since: 15 Apr 2005
Location: Dorset
Posts: 7185
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To be honest I don't see what this has to do with me or any of the members of this site, you can't honestly expect us to get involved as none of us witnessed what happened over that weekend.
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 1:04am |
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RLD
Uncle Ray
Member Since: 18 Jul 2005
Location: could be some where els'e
Posts: 7460
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Surly if you go on these events you do your own risk assessment and then you decide to do or don't Disco3 as nothing to do with this as it was not involved Home of RLD Hidden winch mounts and soon external mount Tree and Rock Sliders Jerry can Holders Spare wheel Locks Off Road Towing Hitches Sankey Trailer Body Fabrications and much much more and keeping a look out for santa
more Helsport tents and other things for camping 
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 1:19am |
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simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Sitting pensively in front of the mouse trap looking at the cheese
Posts: 18155
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Did you sign a waver form before you drove off road ? If so did you read it ?
Usually for these types of events where you drive your own vehicle, usually require you to sign an agreement agreeing that the organizers are not liable for any damage caused and that you have appropriate insurance cover.
I say usually, its not always the case of course with every company or organization.
I would be very surprised if an LRE run event was run irresponsibly though.
Sorry to hear you suffered damage and had to pay out for repairs.
Can I ask what damage was caused and how ?
I also understand why you ask if anyone here was there, I would TBH - someone could well have been. As said though, it appears that the event you attended was not organized by anyone here or for the benefit of anyone here.
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 1:25am |
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RR08
Member Since: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Somerset
Posts: 26
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Since the incident in question I have visited LRE Honiton and spent a day with them care of LRE Malvern and enjoyed this, the event was run well and managed safely.
The reason for the appeal is to make contact with anyone who is a member of the forum disco 3 to make contact with us who was at Snowdonia on 8th of Feb 09.
We did ask the day before if the event was to be cancelled or not by phone and were told it has still on, when you go on one of these events you expect a certain standard under the LRE banner.
I don't want to get too drawn into discussions at this stage as Landrover and LRE are investigating the event running.
Terry
RR08
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 1:51am |
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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 27001
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RR08 wrote:What concerns me is if someone is injured or killed on one of these events as a result of poor management and a failure of the Duty of Care.
In North Wales rescues can be very difficult in winter months due to the weather and access to some sites, the Bala site cannot be easily accessed by Helicopter or Ambulance due to the Forest and Terrain and location.
The site is approximately 1500 ft above sea level and cannot be accessed by conventional rescue resources without considerable difficulty.
Also the weather on site can change very quickly and this is of considerable concern.
If you are going to use these points as a demonstration of a failure of duty of care then the use of the words 'can be very difficult', 'cannot be easily accessed' and 'without considerable difficulty' require clarification as they are appear to just be an opinion...and not necessarily fact.
As someone that has damaged their own vehicle on an event ...I take the view that I am the driver and therefore responsible for my own actions...nobody forced me into the decision that led to the damage. Unless you were implicitly instructed to undertake the actions which resulted in damage then you are running on a sticky wicket IMO....you have a voice box and if you can't say 'Stop' or 'I don't want to do this' then thats the way it goes...and why in my case I'm glad I had full and proper off-road insurance.
I'm not gloating as I don't like to hear of anyone's misfortune ...and there may be much more to this story than has been revealed.... but sometime's we just have to have the balls to stick our hands up and say "yep ...that's my fault"  Existential Phenomenologist.
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 2:12am |
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90BHP
Member Since: 18 Oct 2006
Location: Half way along the road on the right
Posts: 3668
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Not going to get into all the legal blar, blar, blar.
But there are many things to consider here. A few people have moaned about the cost of Eastnor but they won't run an event without three LR vehicles in the convoy. 1 front, one middle and one rear. They won't have more than 10 vehicles max, they also provide radios to all cars so that you can indeed say "stop" or I am uncertain etc etc
There is a duty to care and there is a president set by the advertising - suitable for all types of vehicle, non damaging etc.
Yes a disclaimer is always signed, a good lawyer would dis-credit 90% of these 
Never good to hear of damage, like DG i've knackered mine so speak from experience. "To finish first, one first has to finish ...."
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 11:12am |
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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 27001
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I think that I can speak for the vast majority of members here who would confirm that the events they have attended, either with LRE or via disco3, have been well organised in a professional manner with everyone understanding their responsibilities and the risks involved.
Having read through this thread again ... it's clear that members of this forum are unlikely to afforded the full circumstances of the allegations as this would undermine any actions that RR08 may wish to take. To that end, rather than progress this thread with further speculation it will be locked ...and I would ask members who did attend the event in question to contact RR08 should they so desire. Existential Phenomenologist.
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| Sun Mar 01 2009 11:41am |
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